Of course we know that in life there are no absolute certainties, yes yes we know, but....how much more likely is a member of AOA to match in something as competitive as Neurosurgery versus someone who is not? Is it REALLY that important? What’s the real deal about “the society?”

Hey guys, thanks for voting on the poll. For the overly anxious med-students such as myself, do you mind also writing why you voted on what you did? We’re just trying to learn from those of you who already know. Please guys?

AOA will mean the applicant most likely has everything in place on paper...barring any major personality flaws the applicant should match somewhere.  It certainly sets an applicant apart and is more than a minor advantage.  BUT I am a medical student as well and probably not the ideal person to comment.

there are people elected to AOA that do not match.  there are usually flaws or red flags in their application or interview but AOA status does not guarantee a spot.

AOA is just a small box on the first (or second, i can’t remember) page of your application.  i personally don’t notice it when i read apps.  it’s a bonus feature, much like having an extra abstract listed or paper published or something.  i’m much more interested in someone who has had some abstracts and publications accepted than someone is AOA.  of course, i don’t speak for everyone in the field, but at our rank meetings, AOA never seems to really get mentioned. 

what does get mentioned?
- board scores (sorry)
- research activity
- letters of recommendation
- interviews

Thanks for the reply Ken. I know you’re already like a PGY-almost attending, so are you telling us that senior residents normally help in the decision process?

Kenny Liu - 21 February 2007 06:40 AM

there are people elected to AOA that do not match.  there are usually flaws or red flags in their application or interview but AOA status does not guarantee a spot.

AOA is just a small box on the first (or second, i can’t remember) page of your application.  i personally don’t notice it when i read apps.  it’s a bonus feature, much like having an extra abstract listed or paper published or something.  i’m much more interested in someone who has had some abstracts and publications accepted than someone is AOA.  of course, i don’t speak for everyone in the field, but at our rank meetings, AOA never seems to really get mentioned. 

what does get mentioned?
- board scores (sorry)
- research activity
- letters of recommendation
- interviews

Thanks for the post Kenny.

Just curious, as a resident, why do care more about research activity than AOA?

i can’t speak for other programs, but at OHSU, residents participate heavily in the selection process from the beginning to the end (so don’t make us angry).

for me, being AOA says nothing about your desire or interest to become a neurosurgeon.  it’s like your step 1 score; it’s just a number.  research, on the other hand, demonstrates that you are interested in the field and have the gumption and drive to take part in extracurricular activities that round you out.  research doesn’t necessarily mean that you have to publish in Nature or Science.  if you help out with a case report or do a retrospective chart review, that’s research activity.

AOA has a political slant at my school.  Some great students were passed over because one of my classmates had a parent on faculty… I have to say it lessened the accomplishment in my eyes at my school.  Perhaps other schools are different - I hope.

Thank you very much for those honest replies gentlemen, but please answer this...thus far, the poll seems to have more people who are saying it’s either or (a sure shot or minor positive). Is AOA not necessarily a good thing at some locations?

no, i would say that AOA is generally not viewed as a negative thing.  it should never hurt your application.

Do any of the current residents have advice for those of us applying this summer? Are there organizations that would be advantageous to be a part of ??? Another question...how likely is it that the neurosurgeon giving the interview is a jerk-off or is that rare ????

Anybody?

there is probably plenty of advice on this board already (search for “advice").  generally, GET YOUR APP IN EARLY.  kick major ass on your subi’s if you’re doing any.  take no prisoners.

don’t worry about organizations for now.  i doubt there are any (aside from AOA) that would be helpful. 

it’s pretty rare that the neurosurgeon giving the interview will jerk-off, especially in front of you.  just kidding.  i think the majority of the faculty with which you interview just want to get to know you.  some of them may seem “nicer” than others, but don’t let that get to you.

Cool...thanks Ken.